SECOND RESPONSE, (which was bleeped from the debate on the forum)

Quotes from J.N.Andrews book were given to show that the pioneers did not see the first two messages as "finished" or "expired". Though the pioneers were very firm on the fact that their "historic proclamation" was an established fact, this does not mean they are expired--not at all.

Large sections of John Andrews book clearly say the messages of the three angels are not "finished" and that their culmination is yet future.

He writes: We will now briefly refer to several important facts that prove the present is the period in which the warning of the third angel is to be given. We have proved that the proclamations of the first and second angels BELONG TO THAT GENERATION THAT IS TO WITNESS THE FINAL OVERTHROW OF ALL EARTHLY POWERS and the sublime scenes of the second advent; and that the present generation shall witness these fearful events. We have also shown that the two former proclamations have already been made, and consequently the warning of the third angel is the great them to arrest the attention of every mind. P. 127

We see here that the Pioneers firmly believed that all this would happen in their life time. The messages of the first and second had been sounded, they had accepted the messages and were preaching them, and now were looking deeper into the meaning of the third.

Andrews explains what the results of believing the angels' messages were:
 1. A need of patience in the soon coming of the Lord.

2. Keep the commandments of God, "It should be distinctly noticed that the commandments here brought to view are not the commandments of Christ....but the commandments which God gave in person, --the ten commandments." and have the faith of Jesus.

3. The opening of the holiest of all in the Temple in heaven, by which the ark is seen, is an event that takes place under the sounding of the seventh angel, And as the ministration of our great High Priest is changed to that apartment at the termination of the 2300 days, we understand that the opening of the Temple is marked by the termination of that period, as presented by the proclamation of the first angel. P. 132

4. The third angel warns that those who reject his warning will receive the plagues. P. 133

By Andrews definition there is NO WAY the third message is expired, as Tom and Ford try to teach. And it is also plain that messages of the 1st and 2nd angel continue until the end. Even though they were announced and proclaimed in sequential order in the past, they continue to sound till the end.

"A comparison of scriptures shows us what an hour of temptation and anguish there is yet before us. If men worship the beast and his image, they will receive of the wine of the wrath of God; and if they refuse, it is at the peril of their lives at the hands of men. P. 75

He goes into much historic description of the two "beasts" of Revelation and states it is only when the "whole world" worships the beast, "this has never yet been fully accomplished. It is certain that the time never yet has been when all except true Christians worshipped the beast. But this time is yet to be witnessed in the fulfillment of the prophecy ...It is in view of this scene that the third angel utters his voice of warning. P. 80

"The beast was the papacy clothed with power to put to death the saints of God. An image to the beast, then, must be another ecclesiastical body clothed with power and authority to put the saints to death. This can refer to nothing else but the corrupt and fallen Protestant Church...Another religious power enforces the claims of the first beast and his image, and causes the world to receive his mark. ....the beast and his image unite in this thing in opposition to the saints who are engaged in keeping the commandments of God. ...It is the Sabbath commandment that points out the true God ....."p. 106

And remember Andrews wrote:
 "It is only when we are able to say in truth that Babylon is fallen...the great apostasy in nearly all the Protestant churches which has virtually annulled the commandment to sanctify the seventh day in memory of the Creator's rest. The action of the church of Rome with respect to the second commandment was considered by the reformers a just ground for separation from that church, and yet nearly all the Protestant churches have perpetuated the action of that great apostasy with respect to the fourth....

For us to be able to leave Babylon, it is necessary that the angel of God should illuminate the earth with his glory (Rev. 18:1,2) and dissipate the darkness which its errors have caused.

This angel accomplishes his work in intimate connection with the angel who announces that the hour of God's Judgment is come, and with that other angel who preaches the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. It is at the time of these messages that the people of God are called out of Babylon....The coming of Christ must be preceded by a work which shall establish the primitive purity and this work must be accomplished by the three angels.

 The pioneers emphases that the first and second angel's message had their fulfilment in the past was based on their conviction that the 1844 movement was from God to announce these important messages. They were certain that something important happened in 1844. And that event was the beginning of the judgment in the sanctuary in heaven. The historical "proclamation" anchored them securely to historic dates and made the messages relevant to today's Christian. It did not mean they were expired and finished. Not at all.

As late as 1812 Ellen White writes:
AU.1912-04-15.001
(Reading for Sabbath, April 27) In a special sense Seventh-day Adventists have been set in the world as watchmen and light-bearers. To them has been entrusted the last warning for a perishing world. On them is shining wonderful light from the Word of God. They have been given a work of most solemn import,--the proclamation of the first, second, and third angel's messages. There is no other work of so great importance.

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To see fourth bleeped response click here
More from the pioneers

Index Page for "Pioneers' Writings

The Biblical explanation of the three Angel's Messages
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